Advise for future Maule owner.

Dokmow · Post by **Dokmow** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:22 pm

I am a 2/yr pilot with 150 hours and an Inst rating, looking at purchasing a plane this winter/spring. I really like the Maule for many reasons, but mainly because of back country flying, and keeping up on my inst practice. I ,so far, am a renting C172 pilot, including the 195hp XP and the RG. It looks like I can afford a 70K plane and a quick internet search proves hopeful. When I checked on Insurance, WOW!

I have 0 tailwheel experience

and this seems to be the driving factor for a 4K/yr charge. They require 25hrs dual time, which is no problem in my opinion, other than I have to find a good Maule instructor near Eugene, OR. So my questions..
Do I try to get tail wheel experience before the purchase? Renting eats up savings for the plane.
How do I get the plane here for the purchase inspection by my Mech?
How do I get the 25 hrs dual if the closest Maule experienced CFI is in Portland, or Seattle, or Medford?
Should I take the hint, and have my first airplane be a 172? A 170?
Do I just grin

and pay the man and do everything I can to get the cost down?
Anyone gone through a similar experience?
Thanks in advance, Erick

donknee · Post by **donknee** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:27 am

I would suggest that you start getting some tailwheel experience right away in a c-140/170 or Citabria, Aeronca,J-3, etc. You should be able to get your t/w endorsement in 10 hrs or less. that will prepare you for your transition to a Maule and look good on your insurance app...maybe a better rate than starting with "0". Good luck!
Don

Dokmow · Post by **Dokmow** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:53 am

Thanks for the advice. I think Creswell has an Aeronca to rent to get some T/W time, I will check it out. Any advice on what to look for in buying a Maule?
Erick

maules.com · Post by **maules.com** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 5:08 pm

If you can get your instruction in a side by side taildragger you will be a couple steps ahead when you get your Maule. Forget about how many hours things take, more important is to learn everything the plane can do to you so that you will always proactively be making it do what you want, NOT fly reactively responding to what the airplane is doing to you. There are 80 ways to land a 5 flap position Maule so you should aim at 100 landings min.
If a Corp. or company buys the plane, It can hire the instructor based on their experience. The instructor is PIC until it is time to solo at which time you will have met some of the ins. co. requirements especially if you get some additional tailwheel training while looking for the right Maule.
Initially 180hp will be easier to insure but don't let this stop you from getting the engine you want, though they will be more expensive to buy.
By the way, you don't have to insure the hull unless using the plane for loan collateral

Dokmow · Post by **Dokmow** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:21 pm

Great advice, thanks Jeremy.

AK Mauler · Post by **AK Mauler** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 6:38 pm

I did my TW endorsement in a T-Craft, good training platform. I purchased my MX7-180AC when I only had 75 hrs TT and around 10 TW. I had to get 20 hrs dual before Avemco would insure me, so I found a local CFI to work with me until I met the requirements. I was real lucky that everything fell into place and I was able to hook up with a great instructor at a reasonable rate. I highly recommend the MX7-180. It is a great aircraft, maybe not as fast as the 6-cyl models, but I cruise at 130 mph at 2450 rpm and around 8.5 gph. Also the wide spring gear is very stable.

Good luck and happy hunting.

flyseneca · Post by **flyseneca** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 7:03 am

I certainly agree that you need to get your endorsement and build TW time as soon as possible. It has been my experience, however, that a low time pilot needs the Maule time as well from the perspective of the insurance company. Look around and see if you can find someone who will provide instruction in a Maule. Sure it will take more time to get the TW endorsement than if you do it in a J-3 Cub, but you are looking to build time and to be truly proficient in TW aircraft.

In some cases you can find a CFI who owns a Maule personally and will provide instruction at a reasonable price. You cannot solo the aircraft, but can build TW PIC hours and get the endorsement.

I think your price range is very doable. I bought a 1996 MX7-180B over a year ago with no damage history and IFR equipped for $81,500, and it has proven to be a great airplane in excellent shape. Although a high time CFI with reasonable TW time at that point I took a bath in my first year insurance policy. I had 1 hour of Maule TW time (they were not interested in the 100+ hours of Maule tricycle time) and waited too long to shop for a policy. I wound up with AOPA, and in my second year policy I saved well over $1,000 having added 100 hrs in the Maule and about 200 more TW time--but I believe just as important I found a good broker who knew and understood TW policies.

Final comment is to make certain your TW instructor has had a reasonable amount of time in Maules. I just finished flying with a low time new owner who had a terrible experience with a CFI who it turned out had never flown a Maule in the past. You do not want to pay for his/her learning.

Good luck--

Skip Guimond

DonMc · Post by **DonMc** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:52 pm

Paul Dickerson lives near Coure de lene. He has an M7 and is a CFII. He has a website Airescorts.Com. Paul does guided tours to Alaska, Bahamas, Baha etc. Many hrs in a Maule.

Hope this helps and good luck with your Maule. You can try Gustafson Ins for insurance in Washington. Scott flies a Maule of his own and has been good to me. Gary Tillman was very good to me when I was learning to fly a Maule. I think his wife is carrying on with the insurance business in Rome GA. It is my personal opinion that you are better off to bite the bullet for the first year premium and rack up time and experience with a qualified teacher in a Maule than spend your money renting a "lesser" airplane to save a buck. After about 250hrs, the insurance begins to get reasonable assuming no accidents.

See you at the fly in!

Don

Green Hornet · Post by **Green Hornet** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 1:56 pm

I bought a 1997,M7 235C about 2 months ago. I had 275 hours of Citabria and 50 Cessna 172. I applied for insurance through a broker
(Bill White) he in turn submitted to seven insurance companies and only one accepted me with a $3,000 a year premium Hull included. I currently have 33 hrs & 235 ( all dual with a CFI) landings mostly 3pt with 6 wheel asphalt as well as grass. For me it has been a learning transistion where you just have to do the laps in the pattern. Besides getting used to the high performance torque and flaps the Maule takes some getting used to. My point is that the guy who said bite the bullet and begin with the Maule has a good point. But like the man said get a CFI who has lots of Maule time instructing. It is a challege but in my opinion well worth the time, effort, and money. When you join the the aviation community as a Maule pilot it is an accomplishment to be respected. Besides Maules are a beautiful aircraft to be envied.

Dokmow · Post by **Dokmow** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 9:11 am

Thanks for all the advice! It is very helpful, and I promise to put it to good use.
Erick

mstomlinson · Post by **mstomlinson** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 7:37 am

I know this is a late post to a subject that has been closed out, but it might be of use to those who read the thread in the future.
I purchased a 1997 MX7 180C in August of 2006 after running the insurance gauntlet, ending up with Jeanne at AOPA. I was a 420 hour pilot (mostly C172 time) with zero misshaps who had not flown in 18 years. Before purchasing insurance and purchasing the plane, I arranged about 10 hours of tailwheel instruction in a Piper Pacer, thinking this might get me closer to a better insurance rate and because I thought I needed the refresher. As it turned out, I think my first year insurance premium was to be about $4,200. They did insure my Maule, but they wanted me to get 30 hours of dual time and 60 full stop landings in the Maule before I could solo and another 10 hours before I could carry passengers. Also, my instructor needed over 1,000 hours tailwheel time and 25 hours of Maule time. Luckily I found a retired crop duster pilot with the Maule time in my area and was able to get the time with him. At about 22 hours, my instructor needed to leave for a two week vacation. I called the insurance company and told them of my total hours and, after informing them that I had over 100 landings, they reduced the solo time to 20 hours and passenger time to 30 hours. The point of this long story is that it appeared that the number of landings and the time in the Maule were the important issues with the insurance company. They did not appear to care about the time in the Pacer. Ultimately, the time in the Maule with the instructor was very important to me. I learned, and am still learning how to fly an airplane that is very different to fly than the 172. So, much more funnnn. Jeremy made a statement that the way we bring down the insurance premiums for our Maules is to learn to fly them with fewer misshaps. The new Maule pilots (and I surely include myself in that category) need to get the training and continue the training to become more proficient in Maule operations.

flyseneca · Post by **flyseneca** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 7:56 am

Well said on the insurance issue!! Try to take your tailwheel training in a Maule if you intend to buy one--the extra cost will be well worth it. When I bought my Maule I was a high time instructor with reasonable tailwheel time--but only one hour in tailwheel Maules (100+ in tri gear Maules, but that did not count). My first year insurance was not horrible, but after 100 hours in the Maule I found that insurance carriers who would not quote me in the past were willing to quote at a substantial discount.

Be sure to fly with a CFI who is familiar with the Maule. You will have far more fun, and far less frustration.

Fly Safe--

Skip Guimond

Dokmow · Post by **Dokmow** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 12:23 pm

Thanks to all for the great advice. Some work issues are delaying my time line, but looks like this spring it will happen. Jeremy has a nice M-5 235C down there. Hope it is still around when I'm ready.
Hope to meet you each and buy you a cold beverage someday.
Erick

Mauler · Post by **Mauler** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:46 pm

maules.com wrote:If you can get your instruction in a side by side taildragger you will be a couple steps ahead when you get your Maule. Forget about how many hours things take, more important is to learn everything the plane can do to you so that you will always proactively be making it do what you want, NOT fly reactively responding to what the airplane is doing to you. There are 80 ways to land a 5 flap position Maule so you should aim at 100 landings min.

I've been dying to correct Jeremy for about 6 months now, and I can't take it any longer. The phrase that freaks me is "learn everything the plane can do to you". A Maule never does anything to you - it only does what you tell it to do. If you tell it to roll, it rolls. If you tell it to yaw, it yaws. The scary bit is that for CessPiBeeMoo drivers, it doesn't do anything else! It just does what the theory sez! All of a sudden you find yourself truly as PIC.

This is a hugely enjoyable learning curve - learning to tell your plane your desires, rather than having the designer impose his posthumous will on you. Maules are magnificently honest aircraft. Enjoy.

maules.com · Post by **maules.com** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 6:50 pm

The phrase taken out of context of the full paragraph intent means very little. The intent is; learn how to go into a groundloop so you can learn how not to go into one. Proactive versus Reactive is clearly stated.

Advise for future Maule owner.

Advise for future Maule owner.

New Maule Pilot/Insurance

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