M5-235 0-540 Failure

Discussion on keeping your aircraft airworthy and legal and/or any technical topics.


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Nick
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M5-235 0-540 Failure

Post by Nick »

Need some help here, just made an emergency landing with a significant lack of power and vibration, was cruising home on a crystal clear day temp was 22°C on the ground (3500ft) and 10° at 7500ft, was running 21/22 squared,. after about 40 mins, all of a sudden the engine fluttered and lost power,switched tanks right to left, went full rich, full throttle and full prop, carb heat, nothing worked. Maintained 2000 rpm at 5000ft, very rough running and no egt's showing for left or right mags on cylinders 3&5, #2 is very low as well. Once safely on the ground I pulled the cowlings and nothing looked out of place, checked fuel with no water noted, I did a re-start with no problems, but couldn't get it above 2000rpm and it was very rough running. No abnormal backfiring however .
I just got home and will head back to the plane tomorrow (150miles away) for a more detailed look , gonna pull the plugs and check the filter and screen, any other suggestions, maybe bore-scope the suspect cylinders and check air system,
I put about 2.5hrs on it today and thankfully had just climbed out of the mountains when it happened, thankfully had 4000ft of life insurance below me with lots of canola fields, I managed to limp back to a decent airstrip.
I know I'm a little short on details but it was my first engine flutter and was just looking at landing sites and not the engine gauges.

1977 M5-235C with 1220hrs.
15hrs on new Aerolite ignition harness
Engine is Lycoming 0-540 J1A5D 1220hrs TT
Compression's 15hrs ago were all 78/80

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AndrewK
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Post by AndrewK »

Did you try the aux fuel pump or note good fuel psi? Sounds almost like a fuel starvation issue I had on another plane when the electric fuel pump was off and fuel was being delivered by gravity alone (experimental with no mechanical pump). Ran ok to a certain RPM but wouldn't exceed it and ran rough as it got too lean, gravity psi alone was just not enough.
Note that this was on a different airframe and engine but thought I'd mention it since the symptoms sound similar.
Good job on putting it down safely, I am interested in what you find since I fly behind the same engine in my Maule.

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MAU MAU
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Post by MAU MAU »

Thank God you made it home safe.

I noticed you only have 15 hours on a new ignition harness. Do you think this may have failed or come loose causing the problem?

Please report back as to your findings.
MXT-7-180A Comet

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Nick
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Post by Nick »

I had good pressure, normal at the event and much higher when boost pump engaged, I'm leaning towards harness but really scratching my head right now

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TomD
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Engine failure

Post by TomD »

Holy S*&$ !!

No ideas here, but this is too close to home (N9181E is near cousin to yours).

Don't forget to check the pilot's seat, it probably need maint. as well.

TD

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JDW
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Post by JDW »

Did you check that the primer hadn't popped out? Had that happen to a friend, hope its something simple like that?

Mountain Doctor
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Post by Mountain Doctor »

I will be following this thread closely.

Good flying on your part, well done.

I hope whatever puked is cheap.... :roll:
I am an AME in Richland, Washington. Please call for an appointment!

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MAU MAU
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Post by MAU MAU »

When the roughness and loss of power occurred, did you check both the Left and Right Mags to see if one may have failed?

Many moons ago I had the same scenario, tried the same fixes, and finally switched to the Left Mag only and all was smooth again with almost full power available.

The Right Mag had failed.
MXT-7-180A Comet

Taildragon
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Post by Taildragon »

Nick - I can't help much on the engine issues you suffered due to a lack of mechanical aptitude. I can say WELL DONE in handling the stress of a crisis and living to fly another day!

Cheers

Jim

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Post by Jaymac26 »

Glad to hear you are alright. Scary stuff. I was out flying tonight. I just posted to find out about a tiny bit on nose wheel play when you turn it from left to right while pushing down on the tail. Could hear a bit of clicking on slow taxi.
I am glad you are safe.

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aero101
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Post by aero101 »

Last one I heard of with similiar problem, the governor had been adj'd for higher RPM (from 2500 to 2700) had every valve spring in engine busted, then upon repairing cyl's, found bad FCU and had to rebuild as well? Doubt very much a harness would cause problem unless it had backed out of a magneto completely...
Jim
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Seaplane Maule
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Post by Seaplane Maule »

Do you have a dual magneto or two singles (Depends on engine model) ? A broken impulse spring will alter magneto timing and cause engine to operate rough as well. You may still hear a click even with the spring broken....

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Nick
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Update M5-235 Engine issue

Post by Nick »

Went out to inspect the day after the incident, pulled the top and bottom plugs on #3, it was apparent something broke off in the cylinder. After pulling the exhaust and intake lines off the cylinder it was obvious the exhaust valve broke off. Thankfully it was only in there for a short time and from the looks of the EGT sensor it went out the exhaust and not past the rings. After pulling the sump I only found carbon flake which was very relieving as it would only be a cylinder replacement not a overhaul. I have ordered a new one from the closest supplier (Progressive Air in B.C) total cost is $1750 new, from calling around the cheapest I could find was in texas and cost $1450 plus shipping and duty. Now if I can only find a mechanic in the Rocky Mountain House/ Sundre region of Alberta that can come out and put this on and sign the log books. If anyone has a mechanic in that area please PM me.
Cheers

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xwildcat
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Post by xwildcat »

Excellent job of reporting back and providing pics! They're worth a thousand words.

Everything metal has a fatigue life, but I now wonder what caused this and how common is this type of failure?

Good luck!

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Wyflyer
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Post by Wyflyer »

thats one way to clean the carbon off the spark plugs and piston! The great thing is, the mystery is solved and the repair is in progress.

Thanks for sharing this, someone will benefit from your photos someday.

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