Lower Patroller Windows

ZRotheohv · Post by **ZRotheohv** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 8:53 am

Hi! This is my first post here since I don't have a Maule (yet...) but when comparing them, I came up with some questions. How much weight do the patroller doors add? Does it make the airplane much colder or louder? I have also seen what looks to be different variations. Some have a very noticeable strip of metal between the windows (like the yellow Maule on the banner on the top of this page) while others look like they are almost one solid piece. I have talked to Maule Flight, but are there other entities out there that do the job? Thanks a lot!

JLB · Post by **JLB** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 12:33 pm

The patroller doors don't add much weight if any since the aluminum and the interior door panel is removed and replaced with plexiglass. It can be slightly colder and noisier with the patroller doors, although you can reinstall the door skins for winter use. I have three plus the rear window and I fly in the Sierras in the winter with no problem, although I do dress for egress.

I believe the newer factory patroller doors have a single plexiglass piece top to bottom hence the narrower cross piece. The job is very simple to do and many Maules have this done by owners or mechanics.

maules.com · Post by **maules.com** » Sat Sep 24, 2011 9:22 pm

The no metal strip full glass doors do not have a swingout window above.
The other type on yellow plane do.

ZRotheohv · Post by **ZRotheohv** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 4:35 am

Has anyone had aftermarket rear patroller windows installed? The one behind the copilot looks easy (same as the front ones i assume), but the one behind pilot's side looks different (obviously). Maule Flight says it is done during production and is very difficult to do afterward, but has it been done? Thanks!

maules.com · Post by **maules.com** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 8:26 am

The left rear window is only useful for rear seat observation.
To retrofit you must fabricate a shaped metal frame and weld to the airframe. The wood or metal stringer must be cut and ended.
The fabric must be cut, reglued, tightened and refinished and then the trim made and fitted.
It will take many hours which makes it expensive unless doing yourself.
I have retrofitted skylights successfully and see no reason why you cannot do the window. Have a dedicated fire extinguisher(large) person at hand while welding. Welder must have 4130 experience and be good at it.

Island Flyer · Post by **Island Flyer** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 8:53 am

When we rebuilt Island Flyer, Tim and I put in new patroller windows in the front. I considered the backs but decided not to. The rear on the pilots side would require cutting into the fabric and some welding for the frame as the substructure of the existing frame is in the way. If you happen to be doing a rebuild and all of the fabric is off it would be a lot easier, but even without that level, it would be doable just harder. From Maule you can request drawings that detail the installation process. We used these a lot. There are a few items that Maule does that they use 'shop drawings' that we would not have access to and that's where someone with the extensive and time tested experience like Tim cruises right through. Here is a link to the blog that shows the internal anatomy of the plane in that area when we had it apart. There are several places to see it about half way down on the entry http://web.me.com/rhysspoor/Site_2/Blog ... _Deep.html

Tim welded a couple of times after the fabric was on and as Jeremy suggests have a fire extinguisher. Also, we wrapped the inside of the plane with fire blankets and having a fan to move the welding smoke away if it collects inside helps. When we were putting in the headliner, I broke one of the pins that was welded to the frame and that is right next to the fabric. Tim welded it successfully and no fire

crbnunit · Post by **crbnunit** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 9:41 am

I've seen a few Maules with the rear patroller door and passenger side window. While the door is easy, the passenger side looks like a real challenge. There would be LOTS of work involved. Same goes for the little windows I have seen in the front kick panels. If you are recovering, it might be worth the time if you could do it yourself but it is going to be prohibitively expensive to do if you have to pay someone to do it for you.

I also agree that while they look cool, they would be of no benifit to the pilot.

ZRotheohv · Post by **ZRotheohv** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 9:59 am

Your plane looks great! I see the bar that would obviously get in the way of a clean open window, but would there be any possibility of leaving the bar there and installing the window outside of it? It looks like it had been done to this plane:

And it wouldn't be for me, it'd be for my passengers. Gotta keep them happy too!

maules.com · Post by **maules.com** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:26 am

It can be retrofitted. The plexiglass goes in from the inside and slides down between the bar and the newly constructed frame on the M4,5,6,X7, aircraft.
However the tubes are different on the M7 airframe and the plexiglass will not go in, so a different left rear observer window shape is used than the 4 seated pictured.
Again, yes it can be done. Just takes time and care.

Kirk · Post by **Kirk** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 5:33 am

If you are retrofitting, you can save the interior upholstery that has been cut out. A little insulation on the back side and velcro to hold it to the door frame will give you protection from cold.

The patroller doors were already on my airplane when I bought it. Thought about fabricating something like that, but found I really didn't need it.

The biggest challenge in keeping the interior warm is controlling drafts, which is discussed at length in previous posts. When I do have people in the back seats in cold weather they have a pile of coats back there to push up against the sides if they feel cold.

Kirk

a64pilot · Post by **a64pilot** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 5:56 am

Doors are easy, it does add weight as plexiglass is heavier than the aluminum it replaces. When I had mine done, I had interior panels made that attach to the inside of the door with the same clips that automotive panels use. I worried about the cold and maybe my Wife wouldn't like seeing out too much, she used to be a little squeamish about flying. As soon as she got used to it, I removed the panels and have never re-installed them, only takes a min. to do but have never needed them.
I've had my Maule in cold, but for some reason, it's the warmest airplane I've ever been it. I think sealing the drafts out is the answer, particularly the wing roots, or maybe it's because an IO uses both mufflers for cabin heat, where as a carb motor uses one muffler for carb heat and one for cabin heat?
Do the doors, you will be happy with it.

ZRotheohv · Post by **ZRotheohv** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:05 am

Thanks for all the replies! Does it look like this plane would be a candidate for some swing out windows up front? Or is there not enough of a door frame?

maules.com · Post by **maules.com** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:42 am

Swingout windows can be retrofitted to the door shown.
The broader strip across the door is not structural, but more of a finishing/retainer strip.
Get the drawing from Maule parts first and you will get an idea of what is ahead of you.

worzel · Post by **worzel** » Thu Sep 29, 2011 3:33 am

here is the old link to DIY doors -

http://maulepilots.org/forums/viewtopic ... c&start=30

Lower Patroller Windows

Lower Patroller Windows

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