Insurance

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gbarrier
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Insurance

Post by gbarrier »

Here we go again. I’m old and my underwriter wants a fortune. I carry liability only on our Champ for a couple hundred dollars but they are not interested in writing liability only on the Maule for some reason. Has anyone been successful in getting liability only on their Maule?

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riverbuggy
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Re: Insurance

Post by riverbuggy »

I was able to get liability insurance only through Avemco. The only stipulation was to have a BFR every 12 months.
Previously I had liability only through Old Republic. They required that I have to be accompanied by a CFI, or a Maule rated pilot.
When I informed them that was not acceptable, they seem to be happy I was leaving . The premium with Avemco was about double
what Old Republic required. For me switching was a better fit for my type of flying.
Ray
1970 M4-220C N2056U

netconn
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Re: Insurance

Post by netconn »

I won't like doing it but self insuring is going to be the only option soon. It's just getting too expensive.

yanknbank
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Re: Insurance

Post by yanknbank »

Travers quoted a little over 600 for liability for me. 200 maule, 500 tw, 10k tt. Old Republic underwriter, there want 1350 a year for 50k hull.

VA Maule
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Re: Insurance

Post by VA Maule »

netconn wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2023 9:33 am
I won't like doing it but self insuring is going to be the only option soon. It's just getting too expensive.
Don’t know about requirements for other states but self insurance is not a option in the People’s Republic of Virginia, they demand proof of insurance (liability) every year with State registration renewal.
The best Government, is less Government.

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Andy Young
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Re: Insurance

Post by Andy Young »

netconn wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2023 9:33 am
I won't like doing it but self insuring is going to be the only option soon. It's just getting too expensive.

Could you explain how self-insuring works? Does that just mean being willing to take on all the costs of an incident, or is there more to it?

Dkuber
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Re: Insurance

Post by Dkuber »

I am not a lawyer or anything even close. It leaves my head spinning trying to read their stuff. So, no I can’t answer any questions on it. My understanding of that seems pretty straightforward.

Alaska has this:

AS 09.65.112. Civil Liability For Aircraft and Watercraft Guest Passengers.

(a) An owner or operator of an aircraft or watercraft is not liable for the civil damages of a person being transported in the owner's or operator's aircraft or watercraft if the aircraft or watercraft is not being used for commercial purposes.
(b) This section does not apply to a civil action
(1) for damages resulting from
(A) gross negligence or reckless or intentional misconduct;
(B) an act or omission of an owner or operator of an aircraft or watercraft if the aircraft or watercraft is being operated as a common carrier; or
(C) an act or omission of an owner or operator of an aircraft or watercraft that occurs while demonstrating an aircraft or watercraft to a prospective buyer; or
(2) described under (a) of this section if the owner or operator
(A) has insurance that would compensate the claimant for civil damages awarded against the owner or operator; an owner or operator who is insured as described in this subparagraph is not liable for civil damages described in (a) of this section that exceed the applicable insurance; or
(B) does not have insurance that would compensate a person being transported as described under (a) of this section for civil damages awarded against the owner or operator and, before the person being transported enters the aircraft or watercraft, the owner or operator fails to provide notice to the person being transported that the owner or operator is uninsured as described in this subparagraph.

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DavZeeMXT
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Re: Insurance

Post by DavZeeMXT »

I’m not trying to be disrespectful but how old is “old”? I’m not a kid anymore so I’m wondering as to what my insurance company might have in store for me down the road, or just around the corner as the case may be.
1997 Maule MXT-7-180A
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Kirk
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Re: Insurance

Post by Kirk »

There was a pretty lengthy discussion on the Backcountry Pilot Forum about insurance. One of the posts had a good explanation of self insured vs. uninsured. Here’s my best recollection of what I learned.

Most people that say they self insure are actually uninsured. They plan on covering all expenses of an accident or incident themselves. It’s a choice, works out fine for most people… but then there’s the chance of the big ugly happening and you are wiped out in court.

Self insurance involves putting up a bond for a set sum of money. No idea how that works. Don’t know if that would qualify for the states that require liability insurance.

As for me, I grumble and write the insurance check every year.

Kirk

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Re: Insurance

Post by netconn »

Kirk wrote:
Fri Dec 01, 2023 6:18 pm
There was a pretty lengthy discussion on the Backcountry Pilot Forum about insurance. One of the posts had a good explanation of self insured vs. uninsured. Here’s my best recollection of what I learned.

Most people that say they self insure are actually uninsured. They plan on covering all expenses of an accident or incident themselves. It’s a choice, works out fine for most people… but then there’s the chance of the big ugly happening and you are wiped out in court.

Self insurance involves putting up a bond for a set sum of money. No idea how that works. Don’t know if that would qualify for the states that require liability insurance.

As for me, I grumble and write the insurance check every year.

Kirk
The problem is there's a point where you won't be able to get insurance or it's just too costly.. I'm 70 and I have no problem getting insurance but I have friends that hit the magic age and they can't get it or it goes from 2K to 10K regardless of their experience. I'm not going to stop flying if I can't get insurance, I'll bet more than 1/2 of Alaskan pilots have no insurance ( a lot have no license ). Maybe stay away from populated areas and be more conscious of my surroundings. If I break it I'll fix it, if I crash hard enough it won't matter. Just because you have insurance don't mean you won't get sued.

Kirk
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Re: Insurance

Post by Kirk »

[/quote]

The problem is there's a point where you won't be able to get insurance or it's just too costly.. I'm 70 and I have no problem getting insurance but I have friends that hit the magic age and they can't get it or it goes from 2K to 10K regardless of their experience. I'm not going to stop flying if I can't get insurance, I'll bet more than 1/2 of Alaskan pilots have no insurance ( a lot have no license ). Maybe stay away from populated areas and be more conscious of my surroundings. If I break it I'll fix it, if I crash hard enough it won't matter. Just because you have insurance don't mean you won't get sued.
[/quote]

I dread crossing that magic age threshold. I’m 61 now, hope to keep flying as long as I am up to it. Used to read advice to stay with the same insurer and they would be more likely to accommodate you since they have a history of your risks. I’m not so sure that makes a difference from the stories I’ve been hearing.

I’m up for renewal in December and plan to discuss future plans with my broker. Here in TN, I use DR Cox and have been happy with their service.

Kirk

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andy
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Re: Insurance

Post by andy »

Although my premium has gone up some, I haven't had any trouble getting insurance from AIG through CS&A Insurance (broker). I've been with them for about 20 years. I'm a 76 year old Commercial Pilot ASEL/ASES/Instrument with Private Pilot privileges for AMEL/Rotorcraft-Helicopter. About 3,000 hrs TT with 1,800 in my MX-7-180. Current 2nd Class medical. I keep $120K hull insurance on the airplane and $1M liability. This year's premium was $2,903. About $300 goes to the broker's fee but I can't get to AIG directly. $665 is for liability. The rest is hull insurance. I can't afford to replace my airplane without hull insurance. Plus if I ever drop insurance I will probably never be able to get it back.
Andy
1986 MX7-180
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