Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

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Mog
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Mog »

Ok, I give. What’s the correct method to remove a damaged flame tube and install a new one.

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Andy Young
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Andy Young »

Send it to Atlee Dodge, or one of the other shops that do that.

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Mog
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Mog »

For $1000? Not worth it. I can rebuild it easily, I’m just curious if there is a specific method anyone has used. Mine appears to have been opened with the equivalent of a can open at some point. Pretty nasty. But maybe that’s just how most people do it.

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Andy Young
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Andy Young »

You mean $1000 for both, correct? I just got a quote from Atlee to do mine; I think it was $400 each, or something close to that.

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Mog
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Mog »

I called a few places and they said $1000 each. Didn’t check Atlee. But I don’t know that I have that kind of time either assuming Atlee is cheaper. It’s well within my skill set so...
Just nice if someone has some first hand experience.

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bobguhr
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by bobguhr »

Just for the record I run the Atlee Dodge mufflers on my O-540 and I have had the flame tubes eventually fail in them as well, so definitely make a habit of inspecting them. I replaced the flame tubes once on stock Maule mufflers, if memory serves correctly I took my time grinding down the circumference weld around the muffler exhaust side tube until I was able to pull the tube free from the muffler and then shook the left over flame tube pieces out. The replacement flame tubes slid into the muffler as designed, I tacked them in position and then finish welded the new tube to the old muffler. It was just a take your time and grind wisely situation.

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Mog
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

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So my flame tube was not missing but badly deformed. So it was not able to be easily removed from the exhaust tube. I need to get to my other shop to be able to remove the rest of the tube. But another Maule friend has been working on the same repair but his flame tube blew out on its own. But now he can’t feed the new flame tube into the exhaust. I’m not sure how far he has gone but I do know he gently expanded his exhaust to try to fit the tube. It was never enough so he is going sans flame tube for a few more hours until he figures out what needs to be done. I’m thinking the end of the can really needs to come off in some fashion to do this properly.

I will figure it out, but in the mean time I misplaced my new flame tube so I either need to reorder one or search harder.

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Andy Young
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Andy Young »

I didn’t realize you could buy flame tubes separately. I might have to look into that myself.

Just for reference, I checked my records tonight; Atlee quoted me $390 each to redo the mufflers that I bought from them. Their complete mufflers new are $1000 each. I’d have to get flame tubes from them, as their mufflers are a slightly different design, and a different alloy and material thickness. I’m not sure if their flame tubes remove in the same manner. I think they might attach at the front as well, but I can’t remember for certain; I’ll have to have a look when I get a chance.

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maules.com
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

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Mog wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 9:58 pm
But another Maule friend has been working on the same repair but his flame tube blew out on its own. But now he can’t feed the new flame tube into the exhaust. I’m not sure how far he has gone but I do know he gently expanded his exhaust to try to fit the tube. It was never enough so he is going sans flame tube for a few more hours until he figures out what needs to be done. I’m thinking the end of the can really needs to come off in some fashion to do this properly. ]end of Mogs quote.

To insert the new flame tube, the old spot welds must be smoothly ground away and no collar of old tube remain.
If new tube is a tight fit it can be reformed bit in vice or with hammer enough to slide into place. It is usually just the closed end that sticks as sometimes the welds protrude.

It is highly advisable to be most careful if flying without the tubes on the 6 cal Lyc as the #6 and 5 exhausts are coming straight into the muffler can and hitting/heating/burning/crystalizing/swelling the metal can.
This also happens #4 and 3 but is mitigated a bit by the enjoined flow from #2 and 1.
When the can is very hot and a slight backfire takes place (throttle reduction) a hole can be blown right through. Next line of defense is the cowling.
All the above I have seen take place.
Jeremy
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Maule AK Worldwide

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HeavyLoad
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Post by HeavyLoad »

Thanks for the heads up on the IO-360. Was wondering if anyone had issues with this exhaust system. I have the single exhaust pipe version and on the outside it seems to be in good shape. I'm curious what the inside looks like now.



crbnunit wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:21 pm
For those of you with the IO-360, be careful of the pilot's side exhaust pipe.

First, it is a very complex part with multiple bends on multiple plains.

Second, it snakes through the motor mount. If there is excess play it will rub the mount, necessitating repair... Which makes the opening even more narrow.

Third, this thing passes very close to the gas collator. I think there is a service bulletin directed to this if not an AD. Can't remember.

Fourth, due to the complex angles and close fit, inspection of the top of this pip is difficult. Annual before last I found a large hole rotted through the top of this pipe where it passed through the tunnel in the boot cowl.

FYI.
===========
M5-210C
RV6

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riverbuggy
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by riverbuggy »

Hey Mog, don't feel bad about "losing" your flame tube replacement. I do that kind of stuff all the time. I never find the "lost" one until I bought a replacement for the misplaced one. I try to blame it on old age, but it could be more ----- . Oh well,
Ray
1970 M4-220C N2056U

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bobguhr
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by bobguhr »

Andy Young wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:30 pm
I didn’t realize you could buy flame tubes separately. I might have to look into that myself.

Just for reference, I checked my records tonight; Atlee quoted me $390 each to redo the mufflers that I bought from them. Their complete mufflers new are $1000 each. I’d have to get flame tubes from them, as their mufflers are a slightly different design, and a different alloy and material thickness. I’m not sure if their flame tubes remove in the same manner. I think they might attach at the front as well, but I can’t remember for certain; I’ll have to have a look when I get a chance.
When I spoke to Attlee they wouldn’t sell me just the flame tubes, that was a couple of years ago maybe different now.

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bobguhr
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by bobguhr »

Mog wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 9:58 pm
So my flame tube was not missing but badly deformed. So it was not able to be easily removed from the exhaust tube. I need to get to my other shop to be able to remove the rest of the tube. But another Maule friend has been working on the same repair but his flame tube blew out on its own. But now he can’t feed the new flame tube into the exhaust. I’m not sure how far he has gone but I do know he gently expanded his exhaust to try to fit the tube. It was never enough so he is going sans flame tube for a few more hours until he figures out what needs to be done. I’m thinking the end of the can really needs to come off in some fashion to do this properly.

I will figure it out, but in the mean time I misplaced my new flame tube so I either need to reorder one or search harder.
I bought two Maule OEM flame tubes for the O-540 mufflers I took a chance thinking they would fit the Attlee muffs and they didn’t If I can dig them up MOG you can have them for cost of shipping.

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Mog
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Mog »

So here’s a tip, to remove larger chunks or the fully intact tube you will want to use a pencil torch. I used a map gas/oxygen torch to reach in and melt/cut the flame tube into little pieces. I’m going to grind the welds on the indie of the exhaust tube and see if I can fish a new flame tube in. But I still believe the proper procedure is to open the can completely.

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Mog
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Re: Mufflers, BE CAREFUL

Post by Mog »

Woohoo!! I was able to grind the welds on the inside of the tube using a die grinder with a grey grinding stone. Came out great and was pretty quick. I then used a generic exhaust expander greased up and powered by an impact gun to reshape the exhaust outlet to the original shape. Then for extra overkill I used a three stone hone and cleaned the ID of the pipe. Then I used a hammer to gently tap the new flame tube to make it round. Maule does not make it round at all. From there the tube slips in with little effort. Now I just need to TIG it and make any other repairs on the can and fly.

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