VNE and constant speed prop and puking oil

Discuss topics related to technique, procedures, and idiosyncrasies of Maule aircraft.
Post Reply
xcflyn
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 7:49 pm
Contact:

VNE and constant speed prop and puking oil

Post by xcflyn »

This is tough question to ask here. But I recently got back in my plane after a bit of time off for a double discectomy triple cervical fusion - too many years of being a $hitty dirt bike rider I guess. Any how after some T&G practice I headed back to the airport I park at. On my way in I was trying to beat in another aircraft so I could get off the runway prior to him getting into the pattern (trying to be helpful). I was high coming in and was paying more attention to looking for other aircraft and communication. I got into pattern fairly close to VNE which was a record speed for me and eventually leveled off and focused on getting my brain into landing mode as the winds were doing their mid morning swap and I needed to think about my happy feet, speed, other aircraft and all the other things we focus on during landing. After landing I figured I would tie down and get fuel prior to putting it in the hanger. That's when things got scary.
Oil everywhere. All the way back to the tail wheel. Gear and belly had oil dripping. The A&P that was going to fuel thought it was the drain seal leaking as it was something he noticed needed replacement next oil change. In less than a hour flying it probably puked 1-1/2 + quarts or more out according to dip stick (engine not me). Bottom of engine was all wet and even the forward hole in the bottom of cowl had oil coming out. I went up later to see what was up - assuming cheap fix if there ever is such a thing: they had pulled cowling, Cleaned and ran engine and no major leak ? They did this twice and no real smoking gun. When I left for home last night they were just letting it sit to see where oil drips from.
So two thoughts and I don't know a lot about these engines ; 210hp Cont -injected . But reflecting as I came into the pattern I was fast, and didn't look at RPM or manifold pressure until I was already slowing down. Could the majority of the oil be blown out the tube even though there was oil in front of the tube ? Which is a scary thought of what internally could be wrong. Or from sitting does the engine scavenge oil somewhere and then from now being worked again it sumps it out the breather tube ? Or ???
I will talk to my mechanic again today but thought I would ask. I am sure there is some information missing here to help lead to suggestions. But on the surface - does anyone have any thoughts. Clearly putting it together and just going out flying doesn't sound all that fun when you wonder if its dumping all your oil out on the hill side.
Should I have them do a compression check if they can not find a external leak ? Could I have been over Sq. or over RPM in a danger zone? Can oil under the cowl migrate forward of a leak during flight-seems unlikely but items in the back of my pickup blow up to the cab when driving forward down the road sometimes.
For those about to bash me. I get it, I am a low time pilot and out of practice. Should have known RPM and Manifold pressure during decent. My home airport is a bit tricky from a mountain, narrow, high altitude and paved stand point and I was probably already more thinking landing and wind along with outside distractions and not eyes inside. Looking for help finding solutions here. The flying lesson was learned.

Loogie
100+ Posts
Posts: 128
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 8:54 am
Location: Smithfield, VA
Contact:

Post by Loogie »

Xcflyn, don't bash yourself about engine parameters bringing the plane in to land. If you ask me, your priorities were correct, aviate is 1st priority, the engine didn't loose enough oil to tell you it has a problem. I bet your engine wasn't doing anything abnormal yet since you had enough oil to keep the pressure up normal.
Oil leaks like that will not be a problem to identify, they can come from many places and sometimes they are not obvious, just let the experts figure it out, and certainly don't be a test pilot taking it around for a hop to see if it happens again.
Definitely not normal, that oil is coming from somewhere and will happen again if not fixed, let your trusty a/p take care of it...

VR
Dave
Loogie

pilot
100+ Posts
Posts: 748
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:24 pm
Location: Central LA
Contact:

Post by pilot »

About all you can do is clean it real good and run it. Run it under load, warm it up and cycle the prop. Look at the blowby and see if it is bad - as long as it runs fine I wouldn't worry about a comp test unless you suspect problems after all the above. If it stays clean through all that maybe a short hop around the pattern or two, inspect, repeat.
I can't remember if I fired six shots, or only five.....


M-5 220c, circa 1974
EAA #428061

User avatar
taildragger
100+ Posts
Posts: 132
Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2006 8:17 pm
Contact:

Oil leak

Post by taildragger »

I looked for awhile for an oil leak on my IO 360. My mechanic finally used a dye that you can buy at NAPA and add to your oil. Run it up and then look it over with a black light he had. I had a small crack on one cylinder head by the valve on the back lower side that was so hard to find without that dye. When the cylinder was cold that crack was darn near invisible but when I flew and got it hot it would leak oil. Good luck.

Scott

xcflyn
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 7:49 pm
Contact:

Post by xcflyn »

They searched today and found nothing. So I will fly it one of these mornings this week, do a few full stops and they will see what they see. It certainly could be a crack that only opens up when hot. The dye trick may be worth talking to them about .
Thank you for the feed back !

xcflyn
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 7:49 pm
Contact:

Post by xcflyn »

slight update. Did a couple around the pattern early this morning. Pulled on to ramp to take a look and had 4 runs on the bottom cowl. Figured that was a good place to start before too much oil got blown around. Mechanic came out , we pulled cowl and no smoking gun. We found a few small leaks. one push rod tube, oil cooler gasket, starter adapter gasket (believe that is a o-ring. So that's what gets replaced tomorrow. Then back in the pattern for a few laps and see what we see. One thing I did notice today - my bank account is getting smaller.

VA Maule
100+ Posts
Posts: 420
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 7:10 pm
Contact:

Post by VA Maule »

Has a cylinder been changed out or retorqued ? That can cause a leak on the through bolt(s) . Short runs no appreciable leakage,but get it good and hot and it comes out around the threads and lots of it. The cause of this is movement of the through bolt at the O ring between the case halves.
The best Government, is less Government.

xcflyn
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 7:49 pm
Contact:

Post by xcflyn »

You are a smart man ! That's exactly what mechanic said. All are still the original (only about 260hrs) but he said one leaking bolt even just seeping around the threads can make a heck of a mess. Thank you for the feedback !

xcflyn
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 7:49 pm
Contact:

Post by xcflyn »

looks like they got it. Replaced a few seal/gaskets here and there. But while doing the oil cooler gasket the A&P noticed the dip stick tube lost its seal. He felt it to be the smoking gun ! Been in the pattern a few times with no big leak. Flew it over to the neighboring airport for a couple T & G 's and it looks like it is pretty dry over all. Wish I could say no leaks- but just a couple very minor leaks. It is probably the best its been since I have had it. Still has me concerned but feeling better as time goes by. Now if the weather would straighten out I could get more time in it and get more comfortable with the repairs (and the plane).

xcflyn
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 7:49 pm
Contact:

The happy ending

Post by xcflyn »

Flew from home base 00C to KOLS (Durango Co - Nogales AZ) last weekend. There and back 7.9 hrs and it used maybe 6oz of oil in that time.
I call it fixed - big thumbs up to Wes at Gregg flying service ! Its been a long time since this plane was so liquid tight :D

User avatar
DeltaRomeo
100+ Posts
Posts: 410
Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 3:05 am
Contact:

Post by DeltaRomeo »

Thanks for sharing your findings; it'll help save someone down the road a lot of expense and worry!
M5

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests