Lycoming AD

[RedMaule]

New to the forum, hope this works. Question is what is everyone doing about Lycoming crankshaft ad? I have MT-7-235 with 280hrs on it and apparently until 2013 to get AD complied with. Is everyone going to local A&P for replacement, sending engine back to Lycoming, not worrying about it or waiting for the law suits to begin. I'm a little uncomfortable flying around with a potiential problem that I know about. I think Lycoming is discounting parts through next year only. Your thoughts. RedMaule

[210TC]

I would send the engine back to the factory (asap). Will be the best warranty, workmanship and best for resale.
Remember, thats ALL they do and rest assurd the man that assembles your engine eats sleeps and drinks assembling engine's, not one or two a year, if that.
Check the laws in your state (the state you purchased in will have venue)regarding warrantee. It is possible you could get all expenses (if any) via a small claims court??? NO attorney fee's, If you hire an attorney he will reap any of the rewards and you will be sick when it is over with.
Would be nice if you lived close to the Lyc factory and you could just drop the plane off!!

[a64pilot]

Whatever you do, get it fixed before the discount ends. I'm not sure, but I think it is a rather large discount.

[RedMaule]

I think the crank goes from $2000. to $16000. after Feb. 2009. Bless their little hearts. RM

[210TC]

Food for thought!
It has always been customary for the manufacture to fix at no expense repairs needed do to faulty manufacturing or improper design. I would site the many automotive recall's (most of which are not near as deadly).
I think the court's would use this fact (s) to rule against Lycoming. Court's can and will usually follow legal presidence (case law) and Common Practices (what most American companies do in this case). You have two points that would be almost impossible for Lycoming to overcome.
With a very low time engine and the cost to fix the manufacture's GROSS mistake, I would send the engine to Lycoming with an attached letter outlining this argument and see what they say.
If the engine was near run-out I would just save as much money as I could overhauling it.

[a64pilot]

Rather than sending them the engine, because I'm afraid it would sit there for months while you argued, try the letter.
I would bet though since this is iteration #2 for crankshaft AD's and the first one Lycoming paid for, that Lycoming has been aware of litigation, has factored in the costs and already has a corporate policy in place. That policy could well be pay the ones that squawk and not the ones that don't. What you have to lose is the cost of a lawyer to send the letter. I would give it a try, but I wouldn't bet so strongly on winning that I waited until the $2,000 crankshafts were gone.
I think you have to send in your old one to get the new one, so you can't just buy the crank and sit it on a shelf and wait to see what happens.

[maules.com]

The latest info I have from the Lyc. rep handling this series of SB's. as of a meeting I had with him at Arlington WA in July.
The first callback of approx 2500 engines, Lyc. paid for, including freight, r and r etc. These were engines from the late 1990's which incorporated the failures. The subsequent SB's 569 and 569A relate to engines from approx 1998 and on and for these engines Lyc. will supply the crankshaft replacemnt kit for $2000 if purchased prior to Feb of 2009. The bearings, seals, gaskets, nuts and bolts cost $2000 and the crank is free, BUT if you buy this kit after Feb 2009 then you will be charged $13000 for the crankshaft. When you buy it, the crank serial # will be tied to your particular engine serial # and registered, to avoid resale of cranks, and Lyc will be free of responsibility. It is up to you when you do the crank replacement, however the FAA consider an engine only good for 12yrs from date of 'in service' and hold part 135 operaters to this rule whereas part 91 operaters are not mandated to overhaul at 12 years.
The FAA thus wrote the AD relating to these cranks to require them to be changed at the 12 year point.
So if you have a prop strike, or your engine reaches tbo prior to the 12 year point this will cost you nothing except the interest on $2000 from Feb 2009 until the 12 yr point.
Looks like an incentive to go fly to make sure your tbo and 12yr coincide.

[W.A.T.]

FAA has written AD: 2006-20-09 in a way that makes replacement of the crankshaft mandatory for Part 91 and Part 135 operators alike. Both must comply with the overhaul times listed in Service Instruction No. 1009AS.

In other words, overhaul must be performed at 2000 hours time in service, or 12 years in service, or crankcase separation, which ever comes first.

I am currently in process of ordering the replacement crankshaft kit for one of my customers. At this annual he will be at the 2000 hour mark on his 2002 M-7-235C. He is only using the aircraft for part 91 and the engine has never checked better. I really hate to dissemble this engine while it is running so strong and in such good shape.

[a64pilot]

I'm a little confused, so you can buy the crank kit, sit it on the shelf and wait until 12 years or 2,000 hours?

[maules.com]

A64, that is what the Lycoming clearly explained to me.
The crank is tied to a specific engine.
Don't let it get damp contamination.
Most engines affected are 1998 to 2004 models though there may be some anomalies. Check with Lyc.
W.A.T. , agreed re the 2000hrs as many of the 2400rpm engines can run way past tbo if run and maintained properly but there are some that have been mismanaged and are done before. Usually cylinders and occasionally camshafts.

[a64pilot]

I'm not affected, but if I were I'd buy the kit and run it to TBO and then install the crank. I don't think at 235 horse it's being beat too hard especially if it's in an IO and turning 2400 max. If I'm not mistaken there has not been a single failure, just Lycoming is CYA because there could be.
I would be more comfortable with a Lyc. and a "bad" crank over the Canadian Rockies than a Franklin from what I understand their crank failure rate is.

[Green Hornet]

You never know I have less than a thousand hours on my 1997 235C . My annual was started 2 days ago and we found metal in the filter. The investigation is not finished but the engine guy suspects the lifters, cam shaft. That said he included that the bearings will need to be replaced. One particular set of lifters are shared in the lyc design so they are highly suspect. The compression test were in the 78 range so it is doubtful to be a cylinder. BTW I dodged the crankshaft AD bullet.
The other issue of import is a loose propeller ( spec is 1 degree of play)with a minute amount of grease on the blade. There are 2 options fix the one blade for 1200.00 bucks or do an overhaul for twice as much. The most painful part of this is being grounded for I don't know how long. I know welcome to aviation
Anybody else go through these scenarios?

[210TC]

I'm sorry to hear about your engine.
If I found metal in my oil filter (with a low time high compression engine), I would send an oil sample to a lab for analysis. Many times it can be determined where the metal came from.
If you have a Caterpillar dealership nearby you can get the results in a jiffy.
I would do an internal bore-scope inspection of the engine. Most critical areas can be seen well enough to make tear down decisions. It's possible the metal could be coming from gears or other components (most of the time it is the cam/lifters).
If the engine is shelling metal it would have to (normally) pass through the oil filter before damaging the bearings, unless bypassed???
I purchsed a bore-scope just for aircraft and once you own a good one you will never be happy without one. It's amazing all the things you can inspect (from the serial #'s on your mags and instruments to checking your ears out before a date)LOL... This thing is 36 inches long!!!. Warning, if you buy one EVERYONE will want to use it.
I would not get my hopes up but, I am one to measure twice and cut only once.
If anyone wants to purchase a scope let me know, I did some investigating and found what I think is the best bang for the buck.

[210TC]

Does anyone have any facts about attaching an oil separator to your engine?
I was told that this helps deter camshaft corrosion by not allowing moist air to be drawn up through the breather hose.

[a64pilot]

David,
Please post info on your borescope. The bulb is toast on mine and it is so old, I can't find a replacement.
How would an oil sep keep air out of the crankcase? I have seen none with a one way valve or anything similar. There is some type of dehumidifier you can buy that attaches to the breather. My plan to combat corrosion is to fly every week.