Appraisals vs book vs actual value
-
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:09 am
- Location: Wasilla, AK
- Contact:
Appraisals vs book vs actual value
Man, I be perplexed.
As I continue to search for my perfect plane, I see asking prices substantially above what I arrive at with NAAA and Vref evaluators. For example, there's a '73 M4-210C on Barnstormers. $39500 firm. It only has 771TT but that means a 771 hour 43 year old engine, which in some ways could be considered run out as who knows how much longer before it'll need an OH and a new VAR crank. If I use the 771 SNEW for the engine the estimated value is about $27K on Vref, $32K on NAAA. Going with a run out engine number values drop to $14.7K to $16.3K and again Vref has the lower estimated value.
I'd take my A&P/IA friend with me (he has a lot of Maule experience) to look at the plane, but am wondering when it comes to appraisal time I'm wondering what has been other's experience with this. It's a lot of time and effort to go through only to have an appraisal come back far from the firm price of the seller.
Opinions and personal experiences welcome! Thank you.
As I continue to search for my perfect plane, I see asking prices substantially above what I arrive at with NAAA and Vref evaluators. For example, there's a '73 M4-210C on Barnstormers. $39500 firm. It only has 771TT but that means a 771 hour 43 year old engine, which in some ways could be considered run out as who knows how much longer before it'll need an OH and a new VAR crank. If I use the 771 SNEW for the engine the estimated value is about $27K on Vref, $32K on NAAA. Going with a run out engine number values drop to $14.7K to $16.3K and again Vref has the lower estimated value.
I'd take my A&P/IA friend with me (he has a lot of Maule experience) to look at the plane, but am wondering when it comes to appraisal time I'm wondering what has been other's experience with this. It's a lot of time and effort to go through only to have an appraisal come back far from the firm price of the seller.
Opinions and personal experiences welcome! Thank you.
- captnkirk
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 942
- Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2013 4:54 pm
- Location: Cherryville NC
- Contact:
The question I think you have to ask is what is it worth to you. It's had to find comp's in aviation to help establish the value like you find in real estate. Some lenders have history to refer to but either way run the info by yours to see what they will loan. That will give you some insight into what a neutral party thinks it's worth. That may not be a lot of help but that's my thinking any way. Good luck happy hunting.
Kirk Johnson
If god had meant man to fly he would have given him more money
If god had meant man to fly he would have given him more money
- andy
- Site Admin
- Posts: 1666
- Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2007 2:05 pm
- Location: Lake James, NC, USA
- Contact:
I'm somewhat familiar with VRef and I can say that the value of the various Maule options are not even close to what VRef estimates. For example, VRef doesn't cover all of the Maule year/model combinations and doesn't include any provision for the value of new fabric and paint, which would cost you at least $30,000. The person who completes the online form has to "estimate" the cost of all the items that are not listed in the model and plug in a dollar figure. I think it's mostly good for hull insurance calculations, not for price negotiations.
Andy
1986 MX7-180
1986 MX7-180
- gbarrier
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 1560
- Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:41 pm
- Location: 9NR4 North Carolina
- Contact:
-
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:09 am
- Location: Wasilla, AK
- Contact:
- maules.com
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 3144
- Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 4:01 pm
- Contact:
I use BlueBook and always find it more accurate to work with than Vref.
40 years of evaluating Maules has proven that it is very different than evaluating more common marques with many more numbers of aircraft.
One has to know the market, but it is also important to understand how to adjust for accidents/incidents, airframe time, engine time, options and mods etc.
Don't get tied in a knot wondering how much you "can get it for"
What is the airplane worth to you regardless of asking price, only then can you be a happy buyer, and if the seller sells then you have a happy seller.
The perfect sale.
Do take into account, there is nearly Always sellers remorse and buyers remorse even if it just comes to you as a question.
40 years of evaluating Maules has proven that it is very different than evaluating more common marques with many more numbers of aircraft.
One has to know the market, but it is also important to understand how to adjust for accidents/incidents, airframe time, engine time, options and mods etc.
Don't get tied in a knot wondering how much you "can get it for"
What is the airplane worth to you regardless of asking price, only then can you be a happy buyer, and if the seller sells then you have a happy seller.
The perfect sale.
Do take into account, there is nearly Always sellers remorse and buyers remorse even if it just comes to you as a question.
- Hottshot
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 995
- Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 1:41 pm
- Location: 4S3
- Contact:
maules.com wrote:I use BlueBook and always find it more accurate to work with than Vref.
40 years of evaluating Maules has proven that it is very different than evaluating more common marques with many more numbers of aircraft.
One has to know the market, but it is also important to understand how to adjust for accidents/incidents, airframe time, engine time, options and mods etc.
Don't get tied in a knot wondering how much you "can get it for"
What is the airplane worth to you regardless of asking price, only then can you be a happy buyer, and if the seller sells then you have a happy seller.
The perfect sale.
Do take into account, there is nearly Always sellers remorse and buyers remorse even if it just comes to you as a question.
That is how I work as well, thanks in part to Jeremy's help in working with me.
Wup Winn
541-263-2968
Joseph Or, 97846
info@backcountryconnection.com
wup@maulesales.com
www.backcountryconnection.com
541-263-2968
Joseph Or, 97846
info@backcountryconnection.com
wup@maulesales.com
www.backcountryconnection.com
- flyusn99
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 120
- Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:20 pm
- Location: Juneau, Alaska
- Contact:
Another consideration is how much you value your time. Specifically, if you do find a plane in your price range but "needs work" expect to dump a bunch of your time and more money into it. Like the old adage goes you either pay for it before or you pay for it after, but either way you pay.
So bottom line it might have a higher purchase cost but if the engine is still decent and it was recently recovered those are two of the three big money pits (the third being avionics). I think I would much rather spend another $5-10k up front finding the right plane and not have to spend 6 months in the shop and maybe $5-10k more to make something the right plane... Just a thought...
James
So bottom line it might have a higher purchase cost but if the engine is still decent and it was recently recovered those are two of the three big money pits (the third being avionics). I think I would much rather spend another $5-10k up front finding the right plane and not have to spend 6 months in the shop and maybe $5-10k more to make something the right plane... Just a thought...
James
-
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:09 am
- Location: Wasilla, AK
- Contact:
I appreciate the professional opinion given by you and Wup.maules.com wrote:I use BlueBook and always find it more accurate to work with than Vref.
40 years of evaluating Maules has proven that it is very different than evaluating more common marques with many more numbers of aircraft.
One has to know the market, but it is also important to understand how to adjust for accidents/incidents, airframe time, engine time, options and mods etc.
Don't get tied in a knot wondering how much you "can get it for"
What is the airplane worth to you regardless of asking price, only then can you be a happy buyer, and if the seller sells then you have a happy seller.
The perfect sale.
Do take into account, there is nearly Always sellers remorse and buyers remorse even if it just comes to you as a question.
I do like nice, and flying over fixing. There's a good looking M4-210C on BS, very low time but my big concern is the 800 hour engine that's 43 years old. It spent most of it's life in dry climate, but that's a long time. For almost double the money a 75 M5-210C in IL now that's gorgeous, almost all new stuff in the last 6 years, but $70K seems like a lot of coin. The green MX7-180 that just sold of TAP was really nice IMO, I'd have moved the 696 and airgizmo out and stuck that 430W and Xponder in the center to make it more user friendly. I fly an Airbus, gotta have comfort lol.
I'm financing through my CU (AKUSA) and they require an appraisal and I really don't want to spend the bucks on one to have it miss by $20K or some crazy number.
-
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:09 am
- Location: Wasilla, AK
- Contact:
No Maule for me
Well, today I sat in a really nice M5 I was considering and I just do not fit well. I'm 6'3" 250 and could not move things around to where I felt good. It's now off to find a nice spam can.
-
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 748
- Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:24 pm
- Location: Central LA
- Contact:
- maules.com
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 3144
- Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 4:01 pm
- Contact:
- Andy Young
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 1547
- Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:10 am
- Location: Alaska, Antarctica, Colorado, and Others
- Contact:
Nevertheless, one does have to admit that the Maules have a somewhat unusual, cramped-feeling cabin in the vertical dimension. It took me forever to get used to, and I'm 5'8" and 175 pounds. The combination of the semi-reclined seat and the lowish yoke in the knees are what I noticed most. I actually use a pad behind my mid to upper back to get a more upright seating posture, but I don't have the head clearance issue. Yes, I've checked and my seat is not broken. I also built a drop section into the floor for my heels to get more knee clearanc on the yoke.
Width-wise, the Maule actually has more room than a Cessna 185, or even 206, I believe.
Width-wise, the Maule actually has more room than a Cessna 185, or even 206, I believe.
- TomD
- 100+ Posts
- Posts: 1361
- Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 7:13 pm
- Location: Seattle area ( S43 )
- Contact:
-
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:09 am
- Location: Wasilla, AK
- Contact:
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests