We've only been gathering data for a few hundred years, but some if that data (ice and rock cores for example) tell us about much longer time periods.

With all due respect, your friend is an astrophysicist, not a climatologist. Not his area of expertise.

With all due respect, in recent years, climatologists are looking more like prostitutes...

'So I will do what I can to be a good steward with out being over the top about it.'

Well said Kirk; me too.

If I believe in the GW issue or not has no affect on me not wanting to use resources appropiately. We all fly airplanes though. Most of us ride motorcycles. Many of us enjoy high performance cars. Many of us get on jets and fly to Hawaii for vacation. Many of us have stocks or mutual funds that have stock in companies that produce energy.

It's a bit like the non-vegetarian criticizing a hunter or driving a Prius with his leather shoes on.

The difference in this example is there is no question eating animals and wearing their skin harms them. It remains open for debate that driving a twin turbo V8 kills polar bears.

51598Rob wrote:With all due respect, in recent years, climatologists are looking more like prostitutes...

Nailed it!

51598Rob wrote:With all due respect, in recent years, climatologists are looking more like prostitutes...

...and you haven't even seen what they look like at the Halloween party in Antarctica

Andy sorry but my point was more that my friend Evan spends alot of time looking at data and that is the issue. Yes they have rock and tree rings that give them information but it goes back to the fractal relationship. We have cycles within the cycles within the cycles and yes one tanget of the curve may show a rise or fall but where was that tanget taken from. I believe they have 4 documented ice ages so did man cause those temperture changes? i don't think so.I still am not saying we may are not responsible for some of it but to what degree. I've been gathering info about solar panels for the house right now with the tax incentives it is looking pretty good. Plus i like the idea of removing a little co2 from the atmosphere but I will still be tied to the grid. If it works out I can feel good if not well maybe something else will come along thats better. I quess my point is more that I'm not sure the science is complete yet and i will contuinue to do what I can to help.

The worldwide explosion in the use of automobiles in the last century did have an impact on air quality. Fortunately, the industry made an effort to rectify that (somewhat forcibly). The result is magnitudes of improvement in air quality. This point is a demonstration that resource management is important and doable as the market place drives it. Trading carbon credits is a diabolical scheme to make some wealthy at the expense of others. People make choices in the market place that affect the implementation of efficient and cleaner technologies which is how it is happening, without the use of carbon credits.

When people are burning plastics and tires to stay warm in Juarez, it does no good for El Paso to celebrate an Ozone action day... and no amount of EPA regulation imposed stateside will fix that.