Crosswind landing flap settings

[Gary Raser]

I am working on perfecting my crosswind landings. I went back to the flight manual to see what Maule said. It said max crosswind demonstrated was 12 knots, 14 MPH with a 0 degree flap setting. My question to the group is what crosswind are you guys are capable of, what you are comfortable with, and what air speed, and flap settings do you like?
Thanks for your input,
Gary

[Mog]

I have done some pretty gnarly crosswind gust with full flaps in my M4. I keep my speed up until I’m ready to touch just for extra margin. But the M4 is rated for higher demonstrated Xwind, has larger ailerons and smaller flaps.

[firstmaule4]

with my m7 if you use 3 notch’s of flaps and a stiff cross wind you are setting your self up to drag a wing tip You will run out of aileron control if you get a wing blown up so I have found 1 notch and flying the plane at a higher approach speed keeping sufficient control. My M4 can land in the same crosswind with all flaps pulled and never Feel like it would lose aileron authority however it’s aproach speed is way faster than my m7

[wredick]

First of all, let me tell you what I do wrong. 1.3 stall speed in my M7 is around 55 knots. I am uncomfortable with that speed so I fly the pattern at 70 knots and across the fence at 60. Then I add a little power and let things settle into a wheel landing. Faced with a cross wind, I use partial flaps and look for a three point landing. Partial flaps is dictated by the amount of crosswind. Question for you. Is the first notch of flaps the neutral position, or the next one from there? I confuse myself so easy.
Bill

[maules.com]

Max demonstrated xwind speed is similar as C172 max 'demonstrated". It is not a xwind limitation, it is what the FAA requires the manufacturer to demonstrate for certification.
The xwind limit is whatever the pilot can achieve safely. For some its 5mph for others its 20mph.
If its really blowing, one can make the approach on downwind side of the runway, noteing the landing lights spacing then turn into the wind and land on edge of runway perhaps having a taxiway or smooth exit on the upwind side of runway. With full flaps at minimum speed with hand on throttle, then dump flaps at or a second before touchdown, the plane will stop in very short distance.

[Mountain Doctor]

I fly a Trigear that tolerates imperfection better but a couple of points I'd add.

On a wide runway you can land diagonally into the wind to lessen the crosswind component.

Also unless its a direct crosswind, there is a headwind component that will slow your groundspeed on touchdown. Because of this you need less flaps to acheive a similar rollout speed.

I plan most of my landings for flaps 24*, and add or subtract for special circumstances.

[Gary Raser]

I fly out of a lot of little airports and I am not good enough to try and land anyway but as straight as I can. (aligned with the runway) As was stated there is a headwind component most of the time. I have decided at this time (until I get more comfortable) I will not tackle a crosswind of more then 6 knots. in the M-7 235 C
So if landing Rwy 31 winds 250 at 8kts The head wind would be 5kts and Xwind 6kts
Would any of you guys recommend landing with the flaps set at 0 degrees?

Before I realized Flight Manual recommended 0 degrees I would have used 40 degrees, I am going to be working on this the next couple days hopefully we get some reasonable xwinds on the grass fields, the asphalt makes me a little nervous.
Thanks for your thoughts,
Gary Flying out of O03 Morgantown PA a nice grass field

[Mog]

In all fairness, I pretty much always use grass. Even if there is a perfectly good asphalt runway near by. That always helps with crosswind unless you really let things get out of hand.

[Stinger]

I fly out of a lot of little airports and I am not good enough to try and land anyway but as straight as I can. (aligned with the runway) As was stated there is a headwind component most of the time. I have decided at this time (until I get more comfortable) I will not tackle a crosswind of more then 6 knots. in the M-7 235 C
So if landing Rwy 31 winds 250 at 8kts The head wind would be 5kts and Xwind 6kts
Would any of you guys recommend landing with the flaps set at 0 degrees?

Before I realized Flight Manual recommended 0 degrees I would have used 40 degrees, I am going to be working on this the next couple days hopefully we get some reasonable xwinds on the grass fields, the asphalt makes me a little nervous.
Thanks for your thoughts,
Gary Flying out of O03 Morgantown PA a nice grass field

With that wind I'd default to my normal 40* flaps. 24* would work just fine as well. With 0* you'll just be touching down faster (which is fine) but you'll need to be quick with the rudder pedals and braking to ensure you're tracking straight.

I basically only 3-point land in normal winds, because my wheel landing is atrocious I've found out. But as crosswind components approach ten knots and more, I'll do either 24* or no flap landings with a more aggressive slip and be just fine landing on the upwind wheel and then lowering the tailwheel and downwind main about the same time after.

[Victor Gennaro]

I learned a very important lesson early on. Keep the ailerons turned into the wind from touch down until you stop. It really gets your attention when the wing gets lifted and you see the opposite wing touch the grass. I also used 10 degree flap, 3 point and a few knots faster on the approach.

[montana maule]

For strong gusty conditions I the first positive notch of flaps. (Depends on the model I'm flying.) I do this because this is the configuration I use for take off. If things go bad I push the throttle, accelerate, then fly away. If you just try to force it in the air bad things can happen.

In light x-winds I will use up to full flaps. This will of course give you the slowest landing speed. But as the x-wind increases it becomes a larger percentage of your forward motion. This in turn increases the "crab angle" needed to maintain a straight track on final. It also takes more rudder and aileron deflection to forward slip to come out of the crab to align with the runway. The greater the slip the more drag created. This makes for a higher rate of decent which if not properly arrested will create a bounce on touchdown. Things can go down hill rapidly from there.

Over the years I have found I can handle higher crosswind conditions using a wheel landing. But you need to be very competent in the technique. I have some raw video of some x-wind instruction. The winds were gusting at 22 -27 kts at 40 degrees. The landings will be on the mowed strip. The wind is straight down the runway 32 from the left. This computes to an average of a 16 kt. 90 degree component. M5-235, one notch of flaps, wheel landing.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yz3m9cr52ka8o ... 3.MOV?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jot436lbwv7xp ... ND-4.MOV?d

www.montanabyair.com

[andy]

I use 24 degrees flaps and 60 - 65 mph final approach speed for gusty crosswinds and much prefer grass to paved runways. I've found that 0 degrees flaps makes it more difficult to achieve a steep, stabilized approach and touch down without floating. More flaps increases lift and drag and can be used in crosswinds but the additional lift makes the upwind wing more susceptible to being picked up by the crosswind. You can manage it with aileron correction but I've found that it's easier to use 24 degrees.

[CaseyM]

I had the great fortune of a few X-wind landings above my personal comfort zone in the past week. Most notably 14G19kts. Now before you judge on the velocity, I'm an east coaster, flat lander, and we usually have pretty docile winds out here so I don't get much x-wind practice over about 5-10kts. It was an eye opening and a confidence building experience at the same time. I realized it can be done, and I also can see how quickly it could get out of hand and send you careening out through the weeds and trees.

I don't yet have the courage to try to wheel land in those windy x-wind conditions, especially not with 0* (or dare I say -7*) as my POH suggest. So for now, 65mph approach speed and 24* flaps and a nice 3 pointer attitude with the upwind main and tailwheel touching down first seems to be sufficient. I have tried a few 0* landings and seem to be ok with those... But as with most Maules, as soon as I start to feel pretty confident with my landings, I botch one or two and send myself right back to second guessing everything land.

[LCDRLES]

Yesterday I made two landing using 1 notch of flaps, at 58-60mph, wheel landing. This worked well for me on runway 22, with wind at 300, 19 gusting to 25.
We are “blessedâ€￾ in far west Texas with plenty of wind to practice in...
Seriously, I hardly ever 3 point any more. Wheel landings give us so much more control in the gusty West Texas winds. On the bad days I use 1 notch and land at 55-60 in a wheel landing.
On nicer days I use full flaps and 3 point or wheel it to shorten rollout.

[LCDRLES]

And I almost always land on windward main gear first, then tailwheel, then leeward main.
I’m so used to going this I seem to always land this way now.